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    replies embedded (pun intended):<br>
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    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 06/12/15 07:53, Kirk D Mccann wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAH50q6M+UYowOhh8GPAK2RfHZYCgfjqgZOcMCyo02txs+bTPCg@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">So I've noticed two things that no one has
        mentioned yet.  3 drives running in raid 0 and rebuild times of
        large drives.
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Raid 0:</div>
        <div>You realize that if any one of the drives that are running
          in raid 0 fail then you lose all your data right?  The only
          time you want to use raid 0 is when you dont care about the
          data and are looking for speed.  I use raid 0 for our build
          server build drive because we always have source code that can
          be used to rebuild the builds.</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    The two sets of RAIDs are on different machines right now.  The
    striped 0's are used for video capture, then they are compressed and
    put on different media (blu-ray write-once usually), and then that
    video is deleted from the stripe array.<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAH50q6M+UYowOhh8GPAK2RfHZYCgfjqgZOcMCyo02txs+bTPCg@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div>Large Drives:</div>
        <div>So if you have more two drives mirroring isnt really what
          you want because true mirroring only works with two sets.
           (That could be two drives or two sets of raided disks).</div>
        <div>Since you have more than two drives you are going to want
          raid 5,6, or 7.  The raid that you choose should be based on
          the size of your drives and the class of the drives.</div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    The mirrored drives, qty 2, are each 2 Tb, and are identical
    drives.  Again, intent is easy failover without losing existing
    data.  I'm horrible about doing the proper backups at home.  (Like
    the mechanic's personal car always needs a lot of work.)<br>
    That machine is not a data or compute intensive one.  Email, games,
    and such.<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAH50q6M+UYowOhh8GPAK2RfHZYCgfjqgZOcMCyo02txs+bTPCg@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>If the drives you have are more than 1TB in size and they
          are consumer grade drives then you shouldn't be using raid 5.
          <br>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    I was incorrect; they are RAID 1.<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAH50q6M+UYowOhh8GPAK2RfHZYCgfjqgZOcMCyo02txs+bTPCg@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div>This is a problem because the likelihood of a read failure
          while rebuilding a disk is higher the larger the drives are. 
          So then you have to be able to handle a read failure which
          requires a higher raid.  Check out the calculator: <a
            moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.servethehome.com/raid-calculator/raid-reliability-calculator-simple-mttdl-model/">http://www.servethehome.com/raid-calculator/raid-reliability-calculator-simple-mttdl-model/</a></div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Also if you are using raid dont use Western Digital Green
          drives unless you plan to reflash the firmware to make them
          function like red drives.</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    Will look further into ZFS.  <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAH50q6M+UYowOhh8GPAK2RfHZYCgfjqgZOcMCyo02txs+bTPCg@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div>My recommendation:</div>
        <div>All that being said I am a big fan of Freenas, because it
          uses ZFS.  Btrfs is great but its not quite where ZFS is
          yet(or at least that was the case when I last looked at it). 
          If you go the ZFS route you REALLY REALLY need to read up on
          how ZFS, uDevs, and vDevs work.  Because what many people dont
          realize is you cant just add a single disk to the array when
          you do it makes the entire array fail if that single added
          disk fails.  When you add drives you have to add drives in
          sets.</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Personally I'm paranoid about my data, I use ZFS raid z3 on
          two vDevs, each vDev has 5 2+TB drives.  </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Oh and with ZFS you can use different size drives but you
          waist a good amount of space when you do that.  </div>
        <div>And lastly be sure to schedule scrubs of your drives and do
          it in a way that the scrub will not occur while a long smart
          test is running.  That can cause problems.</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>-Kirk</div>
      </div>
      <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    Thanks!<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAH50q6M+UYowOhh8GPAK2RfHZYCgfjqgZOcMCyo02txs+bTPCg@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div class="gmail_extra">
        <div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at 5:33 PM,
          WebDawg <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="mailto:webdawg@gmail.com" target="_blank">webdawg@gmail.com</a>></span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
            .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
            <div dir="ltr">
              <div>
                <div class="h5"><br>
                  <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                    <div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at
                      3:30 PM, WebDawg <span dir="ltr"><<a
                          moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:webdawg@gmail.com"
                          target="_blank">webdawg@gmail.com</a>></span>
                      wrote:<br>
                      <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0
                        0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
                        solid;padding-left:1ex">
                        <div dir="ltr"><span>On Thu, Jun 11, 2015 at
                            3:11 PM, david <span dir="ltr"><<a
                                moz-do-not-send="true"
                                href="mailto:ainut@knology.net"
                                target="_blank">ainut@knology.net</a>></span>
                            wrote:<br>
                          </span>
                          <div class="gmail_extra">
                            <div class="gmail_quote"><span>
                                <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                                  style="margin:0 0 0
                                  .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
                                  solid;padding-left:1ex">
                                  <div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
                                    I'm thinking about putting all the
                                    computers on the network disk array,
                                    including the SOC's: beaglebone
                                    blacks, arduino mega256, and the
                                    RPi2.  I would not mind doing the
                                    compiles (and maybe even the
                                    booting!) on the hard drives instead
                                    of the limited-life SD cards and
                                    'flash' that are on the SOC's.  Any
                                    of you guys done that?  Everything
                                    in the house is 1Gb Ethernet.  If
                                    only I could get that to the outside
                                    world <heavy sigh.>  <span><span>
                                        :-)     </span></span><br>
                                     Already have the BBB's booting of
                                    the SD card, which you have to do
                                    with the rev B's and their 2 Gb
                                    size..<span><font color="#888888"><br>
                                        <br>
                                        David</font></span>
                                    <div>
                                      <div><br>
                                      </div>
                                    </div>
                                  </div>
                                </blockquote>
                                <div><br>
                                </div>
                              </span>
                              <div>I have thought about it.  At that
                                point you need to consider the transport
                                mechanism between the systems and such.
                                NFS, CIFS, iSCSI?<br>
                                <br>
                              </div>
                              <div>You need to back up.  Live. (ZFS
                                Snapshot)<br>
                                <br>
                              </div>
                              <div>I do not know what you do with them,
                                so I cannot help there.<br>
                                <br>
                              </div>
                              <div>PXE boot?  Other ways to boot?  I do
                                not know a lot about that stuff except
                                the RPi.<br>
                                <br>
                              </div>
                              <div>I would consider bonding more then
                                one port together on the network server
                                if you are doing anything major.<br>
                                <br>
                              </div>
                              <div>I run some VMS over NFS right now, I
                                do not like it.<br>
                                <br>
                              </div>
                              <div>I was using CIFS but after learning
                                that is really bad to do over and over
                                again.  I stopped.  None of this was
                                mission critical.<br>
                                <br>
                              </div>
                              <div>I want speed so I am leaning towards
                                some physical disks for the virtual
                                systems.  In the future I would use a
                                fiber target or bonded target that was
                                dedicated if I wanted network stuff.<br>
                                <br>
                              </div>
                              <div>Fun Fun.<br>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                          </div>
                        </div>
                      </blockquote>
                    </div>
                    <br>
                  </div>
                </div>
              </div>
              <div class="gmail_extra">I forgot to mention.  You are
                going to need a few UPS units.  I have destroyed virtual
                systems when a server that hosts its filesystem has went
                down.  It is not fun bringing it back to life.<br>
                <br>
              </div>
              <div class="gmail_extra">If you are talking about creating
                and image, and having the devices pull any new images
                when new ones exist, still using them on the SD cards
                while they are on, I think you have a different
                situation all together.<br>
              </div>
            </div>
            <br>
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